WEBVTT

00:57:19.894 --> 00:57:20.728
Love.

00:57:20.728 --> 00:57:23.731
My first experience with love.

00:57:23.982 --> 00:57:25.525
It sucks.

00:57:25.525 --> 00:57:27.318
Love is hard.

00:57:27.318 --> 00:57:30.363
Love is hard and it\'s confusing and

00:57:32.240 --> 00:57:35.243
it can be something that is like,

00:57:35.285 --> 00:57:38.288
I don\'t know, it\'s love is complicated.

00:57:39.956 --> 00:57:43.418
I was born and raised in San Francisco.

00:57:43.960 --> 00:57:48.298
I feel incredibly lucky to have been.

00:57:48.381 --> 00:57:53.219
I just think as an environment
it is it\'s okay to be different.

00:57:58.266 --> 00:58:00.351
I never did.

00:58:00.351 --> 00:58:04.481
I mean, I guess I knew that I was.

00:58:07.066 --> 00:58:09.694
And yet

00:58:09.694 --> 00:58:12.697
I was always too,

00:58:12.864 --> 00:58:16.201
too busy to allow it to

00:58:18.661 --> 00:58:21.664
limit my experiences.

00:58:22.540 --> 00:58:24.667
I guess for me,

00:58:24.667 --> 00:58:28.254
because I am gay and I do have a,

00:58:29.589 --> 00:58:32.675
a stutter, I think I am

00:58:35.094 --> 00:58:39.098
I always felt okay to be who I was.

00:58:39.098 --> 00:58:42.101
And I know that\'s a really different
experience than a lot of other people.

00:58:42.936 --> 00:58:46.105
I just had a crush on this boy in church
and he was cute

00:58:47.565 --> 00:58:50.443
because we grew up together,
so we knew each other

00:58:50.443 --> 00:58:52.779
how we knew how we were raised
morally right,

00:58:52.779 --> 00:58:55.782
religiously and culturally.

00:58:55.949 --> 00:58:57.283
He\'s Puerto Rican as well.

00:58:57.283 --> 00:59:00.370
So it just felt right.

00:59:01.079 --> 00:59:03.414
It felt, it didn\'t feel weird.

00:59:03.414 --> 00:59:05.917
Yeah, it just fit like a puzzle piece.

00:59:05.917 --> 00:59:07.710
It was perfect.

00:59:07.710 --> 00:59:10.713
♪♪

00:59:22.809 --> 00:59:26.521
We were brought up differently
because I was more of an insider

00:59:26.521 --> 00:59:27.939
and he was more of an outsider.

00:59:27.939 --> 00:59:30.191
He had more outside experiences.

00:59:30.191 --> 00:59:31.943
And I just had my book.

00:59:31.943 --> 00:59:35.947
My book experiences from school
and my dance. Like, that\'s all I have.

00:59:36.531 --> 00:59:39.534
So that kind of changes.

00:59:39.701 --> 00:59:41.452
That makes us different, right?

00:59:44.497 --> 00:59:47.500
Um, my

00:59:47.750 --> 00:59:50.753
first love, I guess

00:59:53.715 --> 00:59:56.259
I feel like

00:59:56.259 --> 00:59:58.136
he was

00:59:58.136 --> 01:00:01.556
he knew me in a way
that I didn\'t have to explain my speech

01:00:02.807 --> 01:00:05.810
and yet

01:00:05.852 --> 01:00:08.855
he was only

01:00:09.522 --> 01:00:11.274
halfway there.

01:00:11.274 --> 01:00:17.113
He only provided
what he wanted to provide.

01:00:17.530 --> 01:00:24.370
And I chased it because I had never
experienced that kind of

01:00:26.080 --> 01:00:28.583
tension and that kind of love.

01:00:28.583 --> 01:00:31.586
And one day he told me, he goes,

01:00:31.961 --> 01:00:34.505
You got to let it go and I’m like,
let what go?

01:00:34.505 --> 01:00:35.965
He’s like, you gotta
let it go.

01:00:35.965 --> 01:00:37.425
You are you just let it be.

01:00:37.425 --> 01:00:40.386
You are the way you are and let it go.

01:00:40.720 --> 01:00:42.889
And I was like,

01:00:42.889 --> 01:00:44.474
You could let it go, that\'s great.

01:00:44.474 --> 01:00:46.893
That\'s something
that\'s going to be hard for me to do.

01:00:46.893 --> 01:00:49.520
He\'s like, You are you?
I love you for you.

01:00:49.520 --> 01:00:51.648
You don\'t need to be anything else.

01:00:51.648 --> 01:00:54.525
And I\'m like,
I’m trying, honey.

01:00:55.818 --> 01:00:56.986
Yeah, every day.

01:00:56.986 --> 01:01:00.114
Like he is something else.

01:01:01.115 --> 01:01:01.908
I love that man.

01:01:01.908 --> 01:01:04.911
He\'s like, I can\'t see myself
with nobody else.

01:01:08.498 --> 01:01:10.083
I think he was made for me.

01:01:10.083 --> 01:01:14.379
I think God was putting it together,
right?

01:01:14.796 --> 01:01:18.424
And then, life happens, right.

01:01:18.424 --> 01:01:21.844
And then life brought us back together
again.

01:01:22.679 --> 01:01:26.557
And it\'s if it works,
other people might think it doesn\'t,

01:01:27.684 --> 01:01:30.103
or it\'s just odd or weird,

01:01:30.103 --> 01:01:31.646
but it works for us.

01:01:33.231 --> 01:01:34.190
What about love?

01:01:43.157 --> 01:01:46.911
I mean, my experience with love has been,

01:01:49.372 --> 01:01:52.375
as I think you know, with all of us,

01:01:53.668 --> 01:01:56.671
and I\'m maybe difficult.

01:01:56.671 --> 01:01:59.674
I don\'t have an option to

01:02:01.884 --> 01:02:04.887
to to have

01:02:06.222 --> 01:02:08.766
first im...

01:02:12.895 --> 01:02:14.063
impressions on people.

01:02:14.063 --> 01:02:17.066
I don\'t get that

01:02:18.067 --> 01:02:21.279
that luxury, if you will,
because I know what that\'s like.

01:02:22.155 --> 01:02:23.531
So, you know,

01:02:25.575 --> 01:02:27.285
I know that if I didn\'t have

01:02:27.285 --> 01:02:31.289
this this, this otherness, I,

01:02:33.332 --> 01:02:36.043
I might not be able

01:02:36.043 --> 01:02:40.506
to see everyone for who they are.

01:02:43.134 --> 01:02:44.427
I have this thing where

01:02:46.179 --> 01:02:48.556
because now we\'re more, we’re together

01:02:48.556 --> 01:02:52.185
and I\'m more open with him
and I\'m more free with him.

01:02:52.185 --> 01:02:54.771
Right I\'m less inhibited.

01:02:54.771 --> 01:02:56.981
I have this thing where I just

01:02:56.981 --> 01:02:59.275
I\'m fascinated with his back.

01:02:59.275 --> 01:03:00.651
I have a fascination of backs.

01:03:00.651 --> 01:03:05.114
So fascination of spines because my spine
doesn\'t replicate his spine.

01:03:05.656 --> 01:03:08.618
So I have this thing of just

01:03:09.410 --> 01:03:12.413
touching his spine
and touching his back and like,

01:03:12.455 --> 01:03:15.625
feeling every crevice, every bump,

01:03:15.625 --> 01:03:18.628
every bone, every ligament.

01:03:19.545 --> 01:03:22.423
Because my back is not like that.

01:03:22.423 --> 01:03:25.426
And I have the, yeah,
I do it like every day.

01:03:25.676 --> 01:03:30.306
I when I explained it to him,
he understood it and it\'s no to him.

01:03:30.306 --> 01:03:31.140
It doesn\'t bother him.

01:03:31.140 --> 01:03:33.643
Now because he knows
where he\'s coming from.

01:03:33.643 --> 01:03:35.853
As a dancer, and I know

01:03:37.396 --> 01:03:41.275
many people express exactly this,
but as a dancer,

01:03:41.275 --> 01:03:45.071
it\'s it\'s allowed me
to express everything in my body.

01:03:45.196 --> 01:03:46.739
What\'s...

01:03:46.739 --> 01:03:49.700
funny about me is that I think that

01:03:49.700 --> 01:03:53.329
my most natural
form of communication is speaking,

01:03:53.955 --> 01:03:58.125
and that\'s actually kind of where I am
most comfortable.

01:03:58.125 --> 01:04:01.087
It\'s it\'s where I\'m happiest

01:04:01.087 --> 01:04:02.588
and it\'s the hardest.

01:04:02.588 --> 01:04:07.426
And I think that\'s a really common

01:04:11.514 --> 01:04:14.517
duet.

01:04:15.351 --> 01:04:18.354
What you might

01:04:19.063 --> 01:04:21.524
feel most at home doing

01:04:21.524 --> 01:04:24.944
is your biggest challenge.

01:04:25.820 --> 01:04:29.448
That might be in the case in terms of love

01:04:29.574 --> 01:04:33.286
as well, as I feel most at home in love

01:04:34.370 --> 01:04:36.956
and it\'s the hardest

01:04:36.956 --> 01:04:39.333
thing to do as a human.

01:04:39.333 --> 01:04:41.419
I just see us

01:04:41.419 --> 01:04:45.548
as one unit because we are one unit
already, but I just see us

01:04:46.507 --> 01:04:49.510
as one unit married

01:04:50.344 --> 01:04:52.263
and just living a normal life, right?

01:04:52.263 --> 01:04:54.473
You know,

01:04:54.473 --> 01:04:56.475
like when you really love someone
and that person

01:04:56.475 --> 01:04:59.437
really, really loves you,
you can just be you.

01:04:59.562 --> 01:05:02.565
You don\'t have to be afraid
of being judged.

01:05:03.065 --> 01:05:06.277
You and truly, you have to

01:05:07.612 --> 01:05:11.365
trust that

01:05:12.408 --> 01:05:14.201
because

01:05:14.201 --> 01:05:18.414
you\'re okay with who you are
and the person you choose will be too.

01:05:19.582 --> 01:05:22.585
There is really no way to know

01:05:25.087 --> 01:05:27.256
till you go for it.

01:05:27.256 --> 01:05:29.425
Let go

01:05:29.425 --> 01:05:31.135
fall into someone else

01:05:31.135 --> 01:05:35.514
and hope not only that
they\'ll catch you,

01:05:36.307 --> 01:05:39.310
but that they\'ll allow you to catch them

01:05:40.186 --> 01:05:41.979
The act of authenticity

01:05:41.979 --> 01:05:46.025
is the biggest risk
that you could take.

01:16:38.468 --> 01:16:41.471
I know.

01:17:57.339 --> 01:18:00.342
I know.

01:18:36.670 --> 01:18:38.880
Whoever you are holding me now
in hand.

01:18:38.880 --> 01:18:41.091
Without one thing, I will be useless.

01:18:41.258 --> 01:18:43.677
I give you fair warning
before you would tempt me further.

01:18:43.677 --> 01:18:46.221
I am not what you supposed,
but far different.

01:18:53.770 --> 01:18:56.022
Whoever you are

01:18:56.022 --> 01:18:58.775
holding me now in hand

01:18:58.775 --> 01:19:01.778
without one thing, all will be useless.

01:19:02.487 --> 01:19:05.449
I give you fair warning
before you attempt me further.

01:19:05.449 --> 01:19:08.285
I am not what you supposed

01:19:08.285 --> 01:19:10.370
but far different.

01:19:10.370 --> 01:19:12.789
Who is he that would
become my follower.

01:19:12.789 --> 01:19:15.792
Who would sign himself a candidate
for my affections.

01:19:15.876 --> 01:19:19.463
The way he is suspicious, the
result uncertain, perhaps destructive.

01:19:20.422 --> 01:19:22.299
You would have to give up all else.

01:19:22.299 --> 01:19:24.092
I alone would expect to be your soul.

01:19:24.092 --> 01:19:25.719
and exclusive standard.

01:19:25.719 --> 01:19:26.261
Your novitiate

01:19:26.261 --> 01:19:28.805
would even then be long and exhausting.

01:19:28.805 --> 01:19:31.725
Who is he that would become my follower?

01:19:31.725 --> 01:19:35.061
Who would sign himself a
candidate for my affections?

01:19:36.688 --> 01:19:38.398
The way is suspicious.

01:19:38.398 --> 01:19:40.901
The result? Uncertain,

01:19:40.901 --> 01:19:43.904
perhaps destructive.

01:19:44.321 --> 01:19:46.573
You would have to give up all else.

01:19:46.573 --> 01:19:49.075
I alone would expect to be your soul

01:19:49.075 --> 01:19:51.036
and exclusive standard.

01:19:51.036 --> 01:19:54.039
Your novitiate would even then be long

01:19:54.372 --> 01:19:56.374
and exhausting.

01:19:56.374 --> 01:19:57.918
The whole past theory of your life

01:19:57.918 --> 01:20:00.921
in all conformity to the lives around
you would have to be abandoned.

01:20:01.797 --> 01:20:04.966
Therefore, release me
now before troubling yourself any further.

01:20:05.217 --> 01:20:07.385
Let go your hand from my shoulders.

01:20:07.385 --> 01:20:10.055
Put me down and depart on your way.

01:20:10.055 --> 01:20:12.766
Or else by stealth

01:20:12.766 --> 01:20:15.727
in some wood for trial

01:20:15.727 --> 01:20:18.730
or back of a rock in the open air.

01:20:26.488 --> 01:20:27.948
For in any roofed room of a house

01:20:27.948 --> 01:20:31.076
I emerge not nor in company
and in libraries.

01:20:31.076 --> 01:20:34.329
I lie as one dumb, agog or unborn or dead

01:20:35.831 --> 01:20:37.791
For in any roofed room of a house,

01:20:37.791 --> 01:20:42.337
I emerge
not nor in company and in libraries.

01:20:42.337 --> 01:20:47.384
I lie as one dumb agog or unborn

01:20:48.468 --> 01:20:50.262
or dead,

01:20:50.262 --> 01:20:53.265
but just possibly

01:20:53.348 --> 01:20:56.142
with you on a high hill

01:20:56.142 --> 01:20:59.980
first watching my stunning person
for miles around approach unawares

01:21:01.356 --> 01:21:04.359
or possibly with you sailing at sea

01:21:05.110 --> 01:21:06.528
or on the beach of the sea

01:21:06.528 --> 01:21:09.531
or some quiet island

01:21:09.948 --> 01:21:12.951
here to put your lips upon mine,

01:21:13.326 --> 01:21:14.619
I permit you.

01:21:14.995 --> 01:21:18.373
With the comrades long dwelling kiss
or the new husband’s kiss

01:21:18.373 --> 01:21:21.042
for I am the new husband
and I am the comrade.

01:21:22.002 --> 01:21:25.005
Or, if you will, thrusting me
beneath your clothing

01:21:26.172 --> 01:21:30.260
with the comrade\'s long dwelling kiss
or the new husband’s kiss.

01:21:30.260 --> 01:21:34.222
For I am the new husband
and I am the comrade.

01:21:38.768 --> 01:21:40.854
For if you will,

01:21:42.272 --> 01:21:45.275
thrusting me beneath your clothing

01:21:46.484 --> 01:21:48.153
where I may feel the throbs

01:21:48.153 --> 01:21:51.156
of your heart or rest upon your hip.

01:21:51.573 --> 01:21:55.035
Carry me when you
go forth over land or sea,

01:21:57.245 --> 01:22:00.123
For thus merely touching you is enough.

01:22:00.123 --> 01:22:01.666
His best

01:22:02.834 --> 01:22:04.002
and thus touching you.

01:22:04.002 --> 01:22:07.839
Would I silently sleep
and be carried eternally.

01:22:09.925 --> 01:22:12.886
[whispering]

01:22:16.306 --> 01:22:19.184
They will elude you at first
and still more afterwards.

01:22:19.184 --> 01:22:22.187
I would certainly lose you.

01:22:26.650 --> 01:22:29.653
But these leaves conning you con at peril.

01:22:30.070 --> 01:22:33.198
For these leaves in me
you will not understand.

01:22:33.907 --> 01:22:36.910
They will elude you at first
and still more after.

01:22:37.327 --> 01:22:39.621
I will certainly elude you.

01:22:40.956 --> 01:22:42.540
Even while you should think

01:22:42.540 --> 01:22:45.543
you had unquestionably caught me.

01:22:48.505 --> 01:22:50.966
Already you see,
I have escaped from you.

01:22:50.966 --> 01:22:53.259
Already you see,
I have escaped from you.

01:22:53.885 --> 01:22:56.888
For it is not for what I have put into it,
that I have written this book.

01:22:57.430 --> 01:23:00.141
Nor is it by reading it,
you will acquire it.

01:23:00.141 --> 01:23:03.436
Nor do those know me best
who admire me and dauntingly praise me.

01:23:04.145 --> 01:23:06.731
Nor will the candidates for my love,
unless at most

01:23:06.731 --> 01:23:11.486
a very few proved victorious,
nor will my poems do good only.

01:23:12.320 --> 01:23:14.739
They will do just
as much evil, perhaps more.

01:23:15.740 --> 01:23:17.325
For all is useless.

01:23:17.659 --> 01:23:19.202
For it is not

01:23:20.412 --> 01:23:23.415
for what I have put into it,
that I have written this book,

01:23:24.416 --> 01:23:27.419
nor is it by reading it,
you will acquire it,

01:23:28.586 --> 01:23:30.547
nor do those know me best,

01:23:30.547 --> 01:23:33.550
who admire me and vauntingly praise me.

01:23:33.591 --> 01:23:36.678
Nor will the candidates for my love,
unless at most

01:23:36.678 --> 01:23:39.180
a very few prove victorious.

01:23:40.181 --> 01:23:43.184
Nor will my poems do good, only

01:23:44.185 --> 01:23:47.188
they will do just as much evil,

01:23:47.647 --> 01:23:50.650
perhaps more.

01:23:50.775 --> 01:23:52.736
For all is useless

01:23:53.194 --> 01:23:55.822
without that, which you may guess

01:23:55.822 --> 01:23:58.825
at many times, and not hit

01:23:59.868 --> 01:24:01.911
that which I hinted at.

01:24:11.588 --> 01:24:14.132
Therefore, release me

01:24:14.132 --> 01:24:17.135
and depart on your way.

01:25:07.018 --> 01:25:09.229
My name is Charlie Cooper.

01:25:09.229 --> 01:25:10.814
My name is Adam Wild.

01:25:10.814 --> 01:25:13.149
I\'m 44.

01:25:13.149 --> 01:25:14.859
I\'m 39.

01:25:14.859 --> 01:25:18.863
Tell me a little bit about
your family?

01:25:18.863 --> 01:25:19.948
Okay, sure.

01:25:21.407 --> 01:25:24.160
My dad was absolutely in no way

01:25:24.160 --> 01:25:27.163
artistically inclined whatsoever.

01:25:28.540 --> 01:25:30.834
And so he was

01:25:30.834 --> 01:25:33.837
he was an aeronautical engineer.

01:25:35.380 --> 01:25:38.383
My parents are not together
because my dad actually died.

01:25:38.716 --> 01:25:41.678
My my mom was an acrobat.

01:25:42.345 --> 01:25:45.056
She actually sent me somewhere else
to start with.

01:25:45.056 --> 01:25:47.475
I was about five.

01:25:47.475 --> 01:25:49.602
So I was brought up in Grantham,

01:25:49.602 --> 01:25:52.605
which is in the east of England.

01:25:55.275 --> 01:25:58.695
My mom, she was, she was a secretary

01:25:59.404 --> 01:26:01.948
and she didn\'t really have

01:26:01.948 --> 01:26:04.868
any interest in arts, in theater at all.

01:26:04.868 --> 01:26:08.079
And my dad, he was a factory worker.

01:26:08.288 --> 01:26:12.125
He really didn\'t
express a lot of emotion at all.

01:26:12.125 --> 01:26:14.919
I was incredibly academic at school
anyway.

01:26:14.919 --> 01:26:18.798
I basically had managed to gain a place

01:26:19.215 --> 01:26:22.510
at Cambridge University to read classics.

01:26:22.677 --> 01:26:25.054
The only reason that I\'d ever even applied

01:26:25.054 --> 01:26:28.808
for university is because that\'s
what my father had expected me to do.

01:26:30.143 --> 01:26:31.603
But I remember

01:26:31.603 --> 01:26:32.437
vividly the

01:26:32.437 --> 01:26:36.524
day my A-level results came through,
and I remember staring at the envelope

01:26:36.524 --> 01:26:41.571
and all I could think about was I hope
I failed my exams.

01:26:42.155 --> 01:26:45.283
I opened the envelope
and of course I did have the results.

01:26:45.283 --> 01:26:48.912
I sort of had a bit of a meltdown
about that.

01:26:50.371 --> 01:26:52.749
I got very, very sick.

01:26:52.749 --> 01:26:57.128
So my first experience of dance

01:26:57.670 --> 01:27:01.549
was actually the moment where I decided
I wanted to dance.

01:27:01.549 --> 01:27:03.551
And how old were you?

01:27:03.551 --> 01:27:05.470
I was 16.

01:27:07.013 --> 01:27:09.849
So I remember going to the,

01:27:09.849 --> 01:27:14.896
um, the the library and just seeing
what I can find about ballet.

01:27:14.896 --> 01:27:17.857
There was this book.
It was only French.

01:27:17.857 --> 01:27:19.067
I had no idea what it was about.

01:27:19.067 --> 01:27:22.445
So I just ended up
copying a lot of, a lot of the images.

01:27:22.445 --> 01:27:25.073
And so in a sense,
I actually taught myself ballet.

01:27:26.783 --> 01:27:28.451
I remember saying to him,

01:27:28.451 --> 01:27:30.828
I don\'t want to go.

01:27:31.746 --> 01:27:34.832
I have my place, but I don\'t want to go,
because I want to be a dancer.

01:27:35.541 --> 01:27:40.004
And he said, Fine, if you want to be
a dancer, you go do that,

01:27:40.004 --> 01:27:41.798
but not under my roof.

01:27:42.465 --> 01:27:46.302
He was very abusive sort of man,
and I was glad to get out of that.

01:27:46.302 --> 01:27:48.513
I was very badly anorexic.

01:27:48.513 --> 01:27:52.475
I needed to control my life
and it was one of the very few things

01:27:52.475 --> 01:27:55.478
at that point in time
that I had any control over.

01:27:56.062 --> 01:27:58.189
So what I did after

01:27:58.189 --> 01:28:01.192
I took the initial ballet classes was

01:28:02.318 --> 01:28:06.072
try to find out where
where I could go after I left college.

01:28:06.072 --> 01:28:09.284
So that\'s when I started
applying for ballet schools.

01:28:09.492 --> 01:28:11.286
Did you share this with your parents?

01:28:11.286 --> 01:28:14.289
No, I didn\'t share this at all.

01:28:14.372 --> 01:28:16.833
So how long did you keep this secret?

01:28:16.833 --> 01:28:19.836
I kept it secret from my parents until

01:28:20.378 --> 01:28:23.840
I actually was given an audition date.

01:28:24.048 --> 01:28:27.010
What would have happened
if they would have said no?

01:28:27.010 --> 01:28:28.386
Probably just gone and done it anyway.

01:28:29.762 --> 01:28:32.598
So after I left home, I moved
to London

01:28:32.598 --> 01:28:35.393
and I moved into a hostel run by nuns,

01:28:35.727 --> 01:28:39.230
with the plan
being that I would take a job at a pub

01:28:39.230 --> 01:28:43.192
during the night and take classes
during the day at Open Studios.

01:28:44.027 --> 01:28:47.030
That\'s because I couldn\'t
afford to go to a dance college.

01:28:48.489 --> 01:28:51.242
So the issue was that

01:28:51.242 --> 01:28:54.245
because I was suffering with the anorexia

01:28:54.245 --> 01:28:57.248
I was too sick to continue doing that.

01:28:57.290 --> 01:28:58.666
And during that time.

01:28:58.666 --> 01:29:02.795
So sometime around when I was 18,
I was in hospital.

01:29:03.713 --> 01:29:07.842
Oh, at least three or four times.

01:29:08.676 --> 01:29:11.721
So I trained at Center School of Ballet
in London.

01:29:12.305 --> 01:29:19.645
I was 18 at the time and
it was the hardest three years of my life.

01:29:20.813 --> 01:29:24.484
That was primarily
because I was coming from a dance

01:29:24.484 --> 01:29:27.904
background which was pretty non-existent,
and I was training with

01:29:28.363 --> 01:29:31.407
guys who had been dancing
since they were very young.

01:29:32.700 --> 01:29:34.202
Were you the oldest boy in class?

01:29:35.161 --> 01:29:38.164
One of the oldest, I was insecure anyway

01:29:39.374 --> 01:29:44.545
because I did feel like a fraud,
you know, a massive imposter there.

01:29:45.546 --> 01:29:49.008
I think I made,
I think I feel I made the right decision.

01:29:49.717 --> 01:29:52.095
Definitely by the time I got to

01:29:52.095 --> 01:29:53.721
my second year.

01:29:55.098 --> 01:29:58.476
I had got very sick in London to the point

01:29:58.476 --> 01:30:01.604
where I had to call my mom
and she came up and collected me.

01:30:01.771 --> 01:30:03.022
Where was your father?

01:30:03.856 --> 01:30:06.818
He was still at home

01:30:07.777 --> 01:30:11.823
Once I had been brought back to
my home very quickly.

01:30:12.949 --> 01:30:18.246
It was quite weird, but I think somehow my
my illness triggered something within

01:30:18.246 --> 01:30:22.542
my mum to realize that the whole family
environment was incredibly toxic.

01:30:22.875 --> 01:30:24.168
So we left my dad.

01:30:24.293 --> 01:30:25.837
Holy shit. Yeah.

01:30:26.212 --> 01:30:28.714
So I moved back to London and

01:30:31.300 --> 01:30:33.344
started going back to class again.

01:30:33.344 --> 01:30:34.846
Started going to auditions.

01:30:34.846 --> 01:30:37.765
I took a job working as a stripper.

01:30:37.765 --> 01:30:40.476
Eventually I got lucky

01:30:40.476 --> 01:30:43.479
and I took my first job,
which was out in Europe.

01:30:44.814 --> 01:30:47.817
So during my training,
at Center School of Ballet,

01:30:47.984 --> 01:30:50.361
I received a scholarship from the school.

01:30:50.361 --> 01:30:52.905
So my whole three years
was completely funded.

01:30:52.905 --> 01:30:55.908
I want to know why you got a scholarship?

01:30:57.118 --> 01:30:57.952
I don\'t know.

01:30:57.952 --> 01:31:00.955
I honestly don\'t know. I don\'t know.

01:31:00.955 --> 01:31:03.249
He got a scholarship, clearly,
because he was good.

01:31:03.249 --> 01:31:05.501
Well, apart from the obvious reason
for the scholarship.

01:31:05.501 --> 01:31:08.504
I had no idea why I personally got
a scholarship.

01:31:11.340 --> 01:31:14.260
The moment I graduated, I,

01:31:15.720 --> 01:31:16.971
I stayed in London.

01:31:16.971 --> 01:31:20.766
I think I was probably there
about two months before I did an audition.

01:31:21.309 --> 01:31:25.605
And my first job was a show
called One Touch of Venus.

01:31:26.689 --> 01:31:29.692
So I and Charlie are actually married
and we first met

01:31:30.109 --> 01:31:33.654
it was actually at church
and we were introduced by a friend.

01:31:33.696 --> 01:31:36.699
We have been together for, I think,

01:31:38.993 --> 01:31:41.996
11 years and we\'ve been
married for ten years.

01:31:42.538 --> 01:31:43.039
That\'s right.

01:31:43.039 --> 01:31:45.750
If you say so. Yeah, that\'s right.

01:31:45.750 --> 01:31:46.709
Yeah. Yeah, that\'s right.

01:31:47.293 --> 01:31:49.003
Great.

01:31:51.130 --> 01:31:52.965
Do you guys have children?

01:31:52.965 --> 01:31:55.801
Oh god, no. No children.

01:31:55.801 --> 01:31:58.721
We have a dog,
and that\'s where that\'s going to stay.

01:31:58.721 --> 01:32:02.683
Neither one of us is at all
interested in children.

01:32:02.850 --> 01:32:05.561
It\'s just not for us.

01:32:05.561 --> 01:32:08.231
From my perspective, children.

01:32:08.231 --> 01:32:12.735
Children were never option because
I don\'t feel I would make a good mother.

01:32:12.735 --> 01:32:15.196
I\'m far too invested in my own career.

01:32:15.196 --> 01:32:16.822
I don\'t have enough money.

01:32:16.822 --> 01:32:19.825
And I also really just don\'t like
small children

01:32:19.825 --> 01:32:22.745
and I don\'t want to take nine months off
to be pregnant.

01:32:22.745 --> 01:32:24.413
We don\'t have enough time for each other.

01:32:24.413 --> 01:32:28.543
So I just don\'t think why I would
bring another human to get in between us.

01:32:30.044 --> 01:32:32.547
Talk me through some

01:32:32.547 --> 01:32:35.174
some good moments in your careers.

01:32:35.174 --> 01:32:38.261
The tick list was Royal Opera House Stage.

01:32:38.636 --> 01:32:40.346
Achieve that stuff as well.

01:32:41.514 --> 01:32:43.015
West End.

01:32:43.015 --> 01:32:46.310
Achieved that, toured internationally.

01:32:46.602 --> 01:32:48.646
Danced in front of royalty.

01:32:51.023 --> 01:32:54.026
Not sure that was actually on my
tick list,but yeah.

01:32:56.112 --> 01:32:59.448
I think my biggest lowest point was

01:32:59.907 --> 01:33:02.910
when my dad died from a brain tumor

01:33:03.703 --> 01:33:06.038
and I think was because it just made me

01:33:06.038 --> 01:33:09.041
think is what I\'m doing important.

01:33:09.417 --> 01:33:12.420
So the injuries I’ve sustained
throughout my career.

01:33:13.504 --> 01:33:17.008
are I broke my fifth metatarsal

01:33:17.300 --> 01:33:20.052
and trashed all the ligaments

01:33:20.052 --> 01:33:23.055
in my ankle at the same time,

01:33:24.640 --> 01:33:27.643
I had to have two

01:33:28.603 --> 01:33:31.772
toe operations which were called flexor

01:33:31.814 --> 01:33:34.775
to extensor tendon transfers,

01:33:36.068 --> 01:33:37.486
where they also cut out

01:33:37.486 --> 01:33:40.656
some of the bone
and put metal plates into two of my toes.

01:33:42.617 --> 01:33:47.079
I\'ve had another operation on my big toe,

01:33:47.121 --> 01:33:50.583
which I genuinely can\'t even remember what
that was for.

01:33:50.875 --> 01:33:55.087
The first one that I had super
patella bursitis in my right knee.

01:33:55.796 --> 01:33:58.466
Then I had patellar tendon
in my left knee.

01:33:59.759 --> 01:34:02.219
Then I had ankle impingement.

01:34:02.887 --> 01:34:05.890
Sorry in my right ankle.

01:34:06.557 --> 01:34:07.141
A prolapse.

01:34:07.141 --> 01:34:09.518
And became osteoarthritis.

01:34:09.518 --> 01:34:11.020
Well, and still does.

01:34:11.020 --> 01:34:14.357
And then I had herniated disc
in my lumbar spine,

01:34:14.690 --> 01:34:17.026
which then became a sequestered disc.

01:34:17.026 --> 01:34:18.444
What injections?

01:34:18.444 --> 01:34:20.529
I have steroid injections for that.

01:34:20.529 --> 01:34:23.824
Has at any point any of the doctors

01:34:24.367 --> 01:34:28.329
that see you tell you,
I think you should stop.

01:34:28.746 --> 01:34:32.083
I\'ve been told that at least three times,
even for things

01:34:32.083 --> 01:34:33.918
that I haven\'t required surgery for.

01:34:33.918 --> 01:34:37.672
I just every
so often will have to have a steroid shot

01:34:37.922 --> 01:34:40.716
pretty much
because the inflammation that\'s in there.

01:34:40.716 --> 01:34:41.842
What would stop them?

01:34:41.842 --> 01:34:43.928
What would stop?
Stop the inflammation.

01:34:44.887 --> 01:34:47.890
Well, at this
stage it\'s pretty much only the steroids.

01:34:47.890 --> 01:34:50.893
And then well, obviously,
if I stop dancing.

01:34:52.103 --> 01:34:53.646
And what would happen

01:34:53.646 --> 01:34:56.732
if all of the sudden
you really would have read

01:34:57.149 --> 01:34:59.610
classics in Cambridge?

01:35:00.528 --> 01:35:01.153
I do wonder.

01:35:01.153 --> 01:35:03.823
If I\'d have met like some sort of

01:35:03.823 --> 01:35:06.575
academic professor
and we\'d have hit it off

01:35:06.575 --> 01:35:10.871
and had some sort of crazy relationship
where we just, I don\'t know

01:35:11.080 --> 01:35:13.791
translated Latin poetry together
or something?

01:35:14.291 --> 01:35:15.292
Sexy.

01:35:15.292 --> 01:35:16.836
I probably would have gone into research,

01:35:16.836 --> 01:35:19.088
I guess,
because I\'m always questioning things.

01:35:19.088 --> 01:35:22.091
I would have ended up

01:35:22.174 --> 01:35:25.177
staying back in my hometown for sure.

01:35:26.262 --> 01:35:29.849
I\'m not a very academic person, so
I certainly wouldn\'t go down that route.

01:35:30.015 --> 01:35:33.185
Something a little bit more mundane
and doesn\'t

01:35:33.185 --> 01:35:34.895
take so much

01:35:41.152 --> 01:35:42.486
thought process.

01:35:42.486 --> 01:35:44.405
Who do you think your wife
would have been?

01:35:44.405 --> 01:35:46.115
Probably going to be someone

01:35:47.116 --> 01:35:48.576
I either work with or someone

01:35:48.576 --> 01:35:52.121
I met maybe out in town
or something like that.

01:35:52.580 --> 01:35:55.875
I think I probably would have had children
at that time

01:35:55.875 --> 01:35:59.211
because it was an expected thing,
you know, especially my dad.

01:35:59.211 --> 01:36:01.005
He definitely wanted me to have children,

01:36:01.005 --> 01:36:03.382
especially a boy, to carry on
the family line.

01:36:04.008 --> 01:36:06.427
I\'m 47.

01:36:06.552 --> 01:36:08.387
I\'m 41.

01:36:08.387 --> 01:36:11.390
You have decided to retire.

01:36:11.599 --> 01:36:12.600
Why?

01:36:12.725 --> 01:36:16.562
I\'m seriously worried about what
my body is to be like when I\'m 60.

01:36:16.562 --> 01:36:20.149
I literally don\'t want to end up
not being able to walk

01:36:23.027 --> 01:36:26.655
because there is actually more to life
than just dance.

01:36:26.655 --> 01:36:31.118
And all the time
there\'s somebody younger who can do it

01:36:31.243 --> 01:36:34.455
way better, way higher, way more times,

01:36:35.456 --> 01:36:37.082
whatever it is they can do.

01:36:37.082 --> 01:36:41.378
And I just feel like
I can\'t compete with that.

01:36:41.545 --> 01:36:43.672
Are you afraid to see your body change?

01:36:43.672 --> 01:36:44.381
Hugely.

01:36:44.381 --> 01:36:46.842
It makes me feel quite better,
actually, because

01:36:46.842 --> 01:36:50.471
there is nothing I can do to
halt the aging process.

01:36:51.972 --> 01:36:53.724
So it all began

01:36:53.724 --> 01:36:56.811
when I woke up in the middle of the night
in excruciating pain.

01:36:57.102 --> 01:36:58.813
How long ago?

01:36:58.813 --> 01:37:00.481
This was...

01:37:00.481 --> 01:37:02.024
It was about a year and a half ago.

01:37:02.024 --> 01:37:03.275
Yeah, about a year or half ago.

01:37:03.275 --> 01:37:05.319
March. A year and a half ago?

01:37:05.528 --> 01:37:09.365
I saw my sports medicine consultant
who instantly took me in for an MRI,

01:37:09.573 --> 01:37:10.991
and then that\'s when he came back

01:37:10.991 --> 01:37:13.994
and said that it is a herniated disc
in my lower back.

01:37:14.745 --> 01:37:18.999
The sequestered disc
was basically where the herniated disc

01:37:19.124 --> 01:37:21.293
completely broke away from the disc.

01:37:22.169 --> 01:37:26.799
In my case, not only had it broken off,
it would actually floating down my spine.

01:37:26.799 --> 01:37:29.802
From what I understand,
you have the surgery.

01:37:29.802 --> 01:37:32.721
You come out of the surgery
and what happens?

01:37:32.721 --> 01:37:35.140
The surgery didn\'t work.

01:37:35.140 --> 01:37:37.601
So yeah, that\'s why I\'m having to retire.

01:37:40.271 --> 01:37:41.730
What\'s next?

01:37:42.147 --> 01:37:45.150
I\'m going to take a breath and

01:37:45.192 --> 01:37:48.195
try and figure out what else it is
I really care about.

01:37:48.237 --> 01:37:51.323
This isn\'t just something
that I can replace overnight.

01:37:51.949 --> 01:37:53.617
Do you feel resentful?

01:37:53.617 --> 01:37:54.243
Yeah.

01:37:54.243 --> 01:37:55.327
Towards what?

01:37:57.872 --> 01:38:00.875
To slow down and

01:38:01.083 --> 01:38:03.878
have more time for my marriage, I think.

01:38:03.878 --> 01:38:04.628
I don\'t.

01:38:04.628 --> 01:38:07.631
I don\'t want to think of myself
as that person though

01:38:07.631 --> 01:38:11.135
whose life is so empty
that there\'s nothing else in there.

01:38:12.303 --> 01:38:14.305
But I think

01:38:14.305 --> 01:38:16.974
maybe the things that we find interest in

01:38:16.974 --> 01:38:20.853
after retirement might not actually
necessarily be together.

01:38:21.520 --> 01:38:23.314
And then maybe come back together
in the evening

01:38:23.314 --> 01:38:26.317
to actually tell each other
about our lives.

01:38:26.317 --> 01:38:28.027
Actually have conversation.